Episode Transcript
Welcome to Start to Finish Motherhood, a podcast for those thinking or already single mothers by choice, just looking for practical advice, but navigating life's relationships. When you decide to have children on your own, it doesn't mean that you're completely alone. I'm Aisha Jenkins, and I'm partnering with you every step of your journey.
AishaOverdub: Hi, everybody. I am here today with a guest and I'm excited to get into this conversation. One of the things that I wanted to do with this podcast was to talk about the different ways that people can become parents. One way is through adoption. In previous seasons of Start to Finish Motherhood and on my other podcast series, we covered adoption from the perspective of a parent, a mother.
from the perspective of an adoption attorney. And today we're covering the adoption from the perspective of the director of a large adoption support community. And so I have the director here with me today of Noir Adoptions, and it's an adoption networking community. But before we jump into this episode, I'm going to ask my guest Jordan to introduce herself and then tell us the difference between.
The work that you do in comparison to an adoption agency or an adoption attorney. So
Jourdan: my name is Jordan. I'm the founder of Noir Adoption. And I like to say that this kind of happened on accident. I was in a photography mastermind for my photography business while doing that, just talking about the process of our adoption, because my husband and I got placed with our son in 2019.
And I just. Posted on Instagram that we were adopting. So people would stop asking me, are you pregnant yet? When are you going to get pregnant? When are you going to have a baby? Because we had been married for about four years by that point. And from the time I posted that we were planning to adopt. I was constantly getting messages from people asking me, how did you adopt?
Like, what are you doing? Like, how do you talk to people? How do you find people? So it started with me just answering people's questions about what we were going through in the process. And it's just slowly grown from there. And then it was the summer 2022, you should probably put up a website. And I was like, no, I'm just going to wait for somebody else to do it.
And after all these people who didn't know each other said to do something, I decided, okay, I'm just going to pause my stuff. I'm going to put up a website and then we're going to see what happens. So now it's a full blown nonprofit and I help families who are interested in adopting. So we don't do placements because we're not a licensed child placing agency, but I have adoption agencies, consultants, and attorneys who reach out to me from all over the country.
Because they heard that I had a black adoption support group on Facebook, so that was like. My way of kind of helping people is just like, yeah, I just have the Facebook group and I just help support people. And my Facebook isn't searchable. So they had to go to a different adoption group, search through the member list to find me and then message me.
And my husband says, if these people are going through all this trouble to track you down, then there's obviously a need here. So I said, okay, fine. We'll put a website up. And so they all reach out to me to find the families. And I just help the families like if they need help finding a social worker, if they're looking for an attorney, if they need somebody to help them with their profile book.
So I kind of connect them with all of the resources that they need in order to become home study approved or to end up getting matched with an expectant mom. So it just started off as a, you know, I'll just put it up and see what happens. And then last year we had 12 members got placed with babies. It would have been 13, but the New Year's Eve baby decided he wanted to come a little bit later.
So now we're here in this year will be our second year in business. And so now I'm like, okay, well, we're going to double everything that we did last year. We'll see if it happens. And so now I'm like, okay, well, let's actually set like a real plan to see where we can go as opposed to just. If it happens, it happens.
And if it's not, then that's okay, but I'm really fortunate to be able to do it. I just love helping people. I've always come from just like a place of service. So the fact that people see my help as this magnitude of being able to help them. grow their family, it's pretty rewarding, all that in and of itself.
AishaOverdub: Oh, well, thank you. It's amazing. It's a wonder, a head scratcher when people are like, we can't find Black families, we can't find Black people, and I'm just, you know, I think we all side eye, like, You're not even taking the tiniest steps to look because we are here. And so I thank you for the work that you're doing.
And I thank you for your service. And many of the people in my community, thank you as well. And I will be sharing your links inside Start to Finish Motherhood as well. Okay.
Jourdan: said that, that kind of was one of the things where I was like, Okay, something is going on here. Because I keep hearing people say, oh, I just can't find any Black families.
There was an expectant mom in one of the Facebook groups I was in who was feeling uncomfortable about the selection that she made with her agency. They were a white couple. She was like, they're a same sex couple, but I don't have a problem with them being LGBT. The only thing that I'm kind of apprehensive about is they keep making comments about being so excited about getting a Black baby, and it made it feel like the baby was going to be, like, tokenized already.
So then I said, okay, well, why didn't you pick a Black family? And then she responded to me and was like, I didn't know I had that option because the agencies weren't doing any searching for them. So since you say that, we know like, this is actually a thing that is happening.
AishaOverdub: Yeah, I've had probably two adoption related episodes in this podcast series where there is some intentionality about getting Non Black families in front of the expected moms and the Black women in my community having to fight tooth and nail to be seen.
Or to be in the list of expected hopeful parents for a baby. And it's just, you think these things are happening, but to actually hear that they're happening, still boggles my mind.
Jourdan: We were matched with an expected mom the summer of 2022. And she told me that she had been talking with a social worker at an agency, and she was really adamant about wanting a Black family.
And it just got to the point where they told her that a Black family was not going to give her baby the life that she wanted for them so that she should just pick one of the families that they had available to her. And so I was like, okay, well, what is it that you were looking for? She was like, I just want a two parent household that has a yard big enough for a swing set.
So then when she saw our profile book, she saw that. We had a house and we had a swing set in our backyard. And she was like, okay, well, this is what I was looking for. We have nice houses. We have jobs. We make enough money to be able to provide like amazing lives for children. So I don't know why somebody would say that a black family wouldn't be able to give a black child the life that the mom
AishaOverdub: Behind every teacher, behind every adoption attorney, every social worker, there is a human. And with those human beings, they bring their own biases. So let's dive into some of the questions because for each season, I'll throw questions out to the community and see what information they need. Let's jump into, from the beginning, what are the top three things a person should consider when they're considering adoption as their path to parenthood?
Jourdan: first, we need to determine what type of adoption that they want to do. Private adoption is when it is birth parent to adoptive parent. And then they have international adoption. So then it really comes down to, do you want to adopt from foster care or do you want to do private adoption?
Because they're completely separate entities and completely separate price points. So when you do foster care, you're going through the state. You don't really have a say on who you're adopting. They just call and say, hey, we've got a baby. Or, we have a toddler, can you take them in? With private adoption, it is, you're working with the agency, the expectant mom is the one who chooses you, and then you go from there.
But if you're adopting from the state, there is very minimal upfront costs, because you're typically only paying for your background checks, and then the state will reimburse you for that. Then you get stipends for the child while they're in your care up until adoption finalization. with private adoption, you're paying for everything out of pocket.
So you're paying for your home study, you're paying for your background check, there are fees for the adoption, there is no stipend, and then there's also the age difference. So with foster care, it's typically toddlers, elementary school children that are available.
AishaOverdub: Okay, and then does more adoption facilitate or does the community support the different ranges and variations of how one can adopt?
Jourdan: So we don't do facilitation, that's when we would work as like the intermediary between the expectant parent and the adoptive parent because I'm not a licensed agency so I can't do the placements themselves. So the people that we work with, they're all agencies and attorneys and they all typically do infant adoption.
I think the oldest that we've had come through that has successfully gone through to placement was six, but typically they're newborns or just a few months old.
AishaOverdub: So as a leader in the adoption space, what are some good things that a prospective parent should be on the lookout for?
Jourdan: I think the main things that are happening now are the abortion bans that are going on in a lot of places, so I think there will be an increase in adoptions happening, but not necessarily because the mom wanted to place the children for adoption, it's just like she's more being forced into it.
For a lot of people, it would be easier for them to just terminate as opposed to Going through an entire pregnancy and then having to give the child to someone else, some people don't want to terminate and they would much rather have the pregnancy and give the child to someone. So it really just kind of varies from expected mom to expected mom.
Most people within the adoption space, because a lot of it is like faith based, they're always like, Oh, thank you for choosing life. And thank you for making this selfless decision. But for a lot of the times. This wasn't a choice that she made that caused this to happen. It's usually not good where they don't feel brave.
They don't feel strong. This wasn't a selfless decision. This was just something that I wasn't prepared for. This is something that I didn't want to do. So I think taking that into consideration is a really big deal because recently we just had a case came in where the mom was a minor and she was assaulted by an older family member.
So that's not something that you would say, oh, thank you for making this decision. Like, she's a child, she didn't choose this. And so I think that's like a huge part of it for people to take into consideration going into this. I know there are a lot of places who are trying to abolish adoption. They're trying to pass all these laws to make it to where adoption itself won't be an option.
They would rather like guardianship because they feel that the adoptee's identity is being erased by changing their birth certificates. The concept of someone else raising the child will still be there. It'll just be, what are we going to call it? Is it just going to be permanent guardianship? Is it going to be like an adoption, but the child still has access to all their information.
So it's always changing. You really never know what's going to happen. Facilitators used to be legal in a lot of states. And, um, they're cracking down on facilitators because they're unlicensed. And they're unregulated. So if somebody's like, oh, yeah, I'm an adoption facilitator.
I'm like, I'm a baby broker. I can find you a baby, but they're not licensed, do not work with them
AishaOverdub: because
Jourdan: since they're unlicensed and unregulated, there's no oversight on whether or not they're actually working with a mom. A lot of them will say that they are and start collecting fees from you. And then you'll find out there was never a mom to begin with.
They were just taking your money. So, I would say make sure the people that you work with are licensed and they are licensed in the state that they are working in. If somebody is in Florida and they're trying to facilitate an adoption in Arkansas, you'd be like, okay, are you licensed in Arkansas? So many people get so blinded by the hope of adopting that they kind of just look past all of the red flags and they're just like, Oh, somebody said they have a baby for me and I need to send them 5, 000.
So I'm going to go get a cashier's check right now and send it over without actually looking into any of the information without getting proof of pregnancy to find out if there actually is a mom to begin with. The waters can get muddy very quickly if you're not paying attention and having the right support around you to help you say, okay, I don't think this is a good idea.
Let's hold off before you send anybody any money.
AishaOverdub: Okay. So I have a question in terms of licensing, right? Is there a database that you can go look up? If somebody contacts you and you're not attached to an agency, is there some way you can DYI search for someone's license number, search for someone from a professional database?
Is there anything that someone can do to verify for themselves that a person is who they say they are and are licensed?
Jourdan: Yes, every state has a list of licensed agencies. So I know here in Texas, it's the Health and Human Services who mandates the licensing for child placing agencies. You can go to their website and there is a list of licensed administrators there.
It'll have the name they use for their business and their contact information. When it's a social worker, typically in like all their email signatures, there is their license number. If I'm looking for licensed social workers in Texas, you can put their number in and their information will pop up. Same with attorneys, they have an ID number and those things.
Agencies, everybody, there is some type of a database where you can look the people up. Self matching has become very popular recently because Adoption fees are expensive, and every year they just keep going up because of inflation and adoption is a business, unfortunately, as a crazy thing to say that it is a multi billion dollar industry.
So, they want to make sure that their staff is being covered and you're paying for everything from the social worker doing an intake interview with the expectant mom to contributing to the rent of their office space. They're shipping supplies, meals when they're out traveling with moms. So people are like, okay, well, you know, I don't have 50, 000 available liquid that I can just throw at a maybe.
Cause there's no guarantees. You can pay all the money. And the mom has 72 hours after birth to determine if she is going to place, or if she's going to take the baby home with her. And, you know, as a black community, we have a big mistrust in a lot of industries based off of like the history of how we've been treated.
So that makes people nervous to say, yeah, I'll give you 50, 000 and I'm not sure I'm going to walk away from this with the baby. So people are turning to self matching online. And if you're in an agency only state, you're not allowed to self match, you would have to go through your agency. So, if you do come across somebody who says that she is pregnant and wants to place her baby with you, then she has to sign up with your agency.
And then you would still be paying those agency fees. In Texas, it's not. So, if I met a mom somewhere, like a mom out the grocery store, and just randomly strike up a conversation with somebody who says that she's pregnant and wants to place her baby for adoption but doesn't know who to choose, and then I say like, oh, we're home study approved and then we would just need to have an attorney because they would have to process the paperwork because you can't just give me the baby and walk away.
Cause that's, it's an abandonment and there has to be legal paperwork to track, like, where did this child come from? Otherwise people would assume that we just kidnapped somebody's baby. So I encourage people to try to self match, but I also make sure they know that there are risks involved. Since there are no agencies or adoption professionals involved, there's a lot of legwork you have to do on your own to make sure that it is legitimate, because unfortunately, adoption scams are a thing.
And it is very hard to prosecute somebody for an adoption scam, because most states consider any expenses or like money, paying bills or anything like that, they consider that a gift. So unless you're able to prove that she had the intent to defraud you, it's hard to press charges for that. So I told people, do not send any money to anybody.
Get an attorney first, at minimum, get an attorney. Right. So then we'll do a free consultation. Even if they charge you a consultation fee, it'd be better to pay this attorney their 150 to find out whether or not this person is legitimate than to start paying their rent for six months only to find out.
that five other people have been paying their bills for the past six months and she never intended on placing the baby for adoption. So now you're out of six months worth of rent when you could have just paid somebody's consultation fee and they would have told you no, don't do that.
AishaOverdub: The next question is, Specific to single black women, are there any consistent hurdles or complexities involved in single parent adoption that we should be aware of? And does it matter where you adopt geographically?
Jourdan: Geographically, it doesn't matter. I would just say to focus on states that actually have like a good demographic of black people, because if I'm calling an adoption agency, one of the things I want to know is do you work with black expectant moms?
Because if they say, Oh, we work with like 50 moms per year. And then I say, okay, well, how many of those are black? And if they say one, then I'm probably not going to sign up with them. So I usually focus on the South because that's where there's like a huge population of black people. So I tell people to focus on those States.
Primarily, if you live in New York or New Jersey, it is significantly harder to adopt because their adoption laws are very strict. So with them, it's better to work with an adoption attorney. Because attorneys have a little bit more flexibility as far as what it is that they're allowed to do. I believe New York and New Jersey, both of them after a certain point, the agency gets cut out.
So, then it's only attorney to attorney and most agencies don't want to get cut out because then. They lose their fees. So, I would say if you're in New York, New Jersey, try to find either an adoption attorney or an agency that will work in New York and New Jersey. For the single moms, the biggest hurdle that I've seen is with Southern agencies or faith based agencies that believe that it needs to be a two parent household.
They are tied to the church. They believe in only heterosexual married couples. Being the ones that they work with, but we know that black women being single moms by choice is on the rise because a lot of them are like, well, you know, I never wanted to be married, but I did want to have kids because I just believe that not everybody is meant to be married.
So if you're somebody who doesn't want to get married, but you still want to have children, like, you shouldn't be penalized for that. And as somebody who grew up in a home where I had a two parent household, but they weren't married, I was like, why don't you just get a divorce? Like, it would be so much better if you were just single, like we will be fine.
But yeah, so that'd be like, the main thing is when the agency themselves don't work with single moms, or they don't think that single parents would be. if the agency will only work with couples, then they won't accept the profile of a single mom. I've been trying to get them to open up more.
Like there's one who recently started working with single moms because a lot of them just assume like, oh, if you're single, you're struggling. And I'm like, the single moms who reach out to me, they are educated. They've got at least one degree, sometimes two and a master's. They usually own their own home.
They have a strong family system. They have the support they need. They just, Are ready to be a mom sometimes. So like, yeah, you know, I was engaged. I was married, but he cheated on me or he didn't want children or he passed away or something. And so now this is me trying to move into that next stage of my life.
I don't feel like you should be penalized for wanting to be a mom just because you haven't met. the right person yet.
AishaOverdub: Right. Okay. And so thank you for that. And thank you for the work that you're doing in having these conversations with adoption agencies that, you know, let's get out of the 1950s. Let's move forward into recent years and understand that the landscape has changed.
Okay. So some of the questions That we also get, one of the questions that I also got were questions around, we talked about choice of agency, what are the standard costs that. Are involved in an adoption, and then what does it cover? Right? So we hear that adoption can be expensive. We hear that there are grants out there that you can get, but what is covered in the fee that someone might pay for working with an adoption agency or attorney?
Jourdan: the national 000. I've seen them go as low as 25, 000, depending on the age of the child, and then if there are any. Significant exposures, health conditions, and then I've also seen them go as high as 67, I think was the highest that I've seen. So close to 70, 000 for it, and it covers everything from the attorneys involved, the social workers, the intake interviews.
They cover any medical co pays the mom has. Each state has a cap typically on expenses, so rent, groceries, any utility bills, they'll buy them clothes, sometimes it's transportation, getting them a phone. So for some moms, it can be higher than others. There are some agencies who will have like a flexible type of a fee structure where it's based off of each individual mom's needs.
Other agencies will just have a flat fee and say like, okay, we're going to estimate 10, 000 in living expenses for this mom, but if she doesn't use that full 10, 000, then the money will just go into a pot that another expected mom would end up utilizing. So that can be kind of. Ify, for me, because I'm like, okay, well, if the mom that I've matched with doesn't want any of her expenses covered, then why should I have to pay for expenses?
If she's like, oh no, I have a job, I have health insurance, I just can't take on any more children, then I feel like we should reflect that, but a lot of the agencies kind of like Choose how they want to set up their fee structure. And sometimes legal is included all the way through finalization. Other agencies, you wouldn't have to have your own attorney in your state.
It really kind of varies. Sometimes they offer counseling to the expectant mom and most of them, I think almost all of them, do support up to six weeks. Some of them do support up to eight weeks post placement. If she's homeless, then they have to find her a place to live.
Either put a down payment down on an apartment for her or sometimes they put them in like an extended stay hotel during the duration of their pregnancy.
AishaOverdub: They don't care about what happens after.
Jourdan: Okay, so and I just think like here's this lady walking around sore from like her c section scar like and she's got to get out of this hotel like you know hopefully they find her somewhere because you know you never know what happens after.
With the mom.
AishaOverdub: So, Jordan, I have a question in terms of the fee structure. Do some agencies or some firms have like a sliding fee? I know that there are grants that people can get. Is any of this negotiable?
Jourdan: They're not negotiable. Unfortunately, the fee is the fee. There are some places that do sliding scales, but it's based off of income.
They are one of the few ones that no payment is due until after placement. So, I believe, like, 10 days after placement. So that's usually around the time when the is cleared and you're going to be able to go back home and be able to pay your fees and that gives you some flexibilities. If you get a grant, they don't just say, okay, yeah, you're awarded 15, 000 dollars.
It goes directly to the adoption agency or the adoption attorney. And it only goes to a licensed person. It goes straight to the agency. So that's why some places will allow you a few days post placement for payment because they know, okay, well, you've got to reach out to the grant writer, let them know that you've gotten placement.
If it's over a weekend, the check's not going to clear because of the bank. So they give you a little bit more flexibility with that. But that is probably the only one that I've worked with that does have a sliding scale. But typically, there's still going to be some, like, significant financial, you know, outcome for the hopeful adoptive parent.
It just varies based off of what agency that you go through, how much you get in grants. Most grants are tied to a church, so they want to know, like, you go to church, sometimes they want a letter from your pastor or from your deacon. Some of them want to know how much you pay in tithes every year, like how dedicated are you to
AishaOverdub: the
Jourdan: church.
AishaOverdub: I just go on major holidays.
Jourdan: Yes, for me, my husband and I, we don't qualify for most of the grants because we don't go to church and my husband was raised in a slum. Unless there's a, I used to be a church kid grant, then I'll apply for that one. You have to have some type of financial commitment. In order to get a grant, so they're not going to just award you a grant if you haven't paid anything.
You have to be homesteading and they want to know that you've made some financial contributions towards your adoption because most of them will cover the 2nd half. So, you've already gotten matched with and now it's the remaining fees before placement. If you already got in place, they won't give you the grant.
Usually.
AishaOverdub: Oh, okay. All right. So, two questions. Can you explain what's all involved in the home study?
Jourdan: ICPC. That is basically the states communicating to each other to say that you are legally allowed to leave with that child. It really depends on the courts. From wherever you are, like, if you're in a small town that has a small court and they're kind of backlog, it can take longer.
So, it is basically like, paperwork that the social worker or the attorney files with the state that you're in. So, I'm in Texas, so say I have to go to Florida. So, I have to get permission from Florida to be able to leave the state with the child and then I got to get permission from Texas to bring the child to Texas.
So, it's this process between the states that say, like, yes, this person can legally leave the state. With this child, because otherwise they'll just see it as kidnapping. Usually it's anywhere from seven days to 14 days. So like one to two weeks. So I tell people like, make sure that you've planned for being out of town for at least two weeks, because that cost right there will add up between the hotel or the Airbnb, your rental car, your flights, most people tend to drive.
If it's within a few hours to save money on their flights. Especially when you don't know when your return flight is going to be. So that is also something people don't really consider. They think like, oh, I'm just going to be able to pick a baby and go home. But, you know, a lot of people, they have to let their job know like, hey, I'm in the process to adopt and I might have to take off a week or I don't have to work remotely for this week.
And so we had one where it was right before Thanksgiving. So I was like, oh no, I thought they were going to end up being delayed because of the holiday. But fortunately the people were like, Oh no, we're going to try to get this done before we close. So I think that was one of the shortest ICPCs I'd ever seen.
They didn't want them to be stuck there because they were going to be closed that Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. And then I think that following Monday, they were also going to be closed. So then that was going to push it out an addition of four days from the usual time. The typical time that I'd seen was two weeks, but since so many jobs now are able to be remote, it's been a lot easier for people to do it back before the pandemic, when everyone actually had to be in their jobs, it was much harder because if you're like, okay, well, I only have two weeks of PTO and then you try to cash it out for that, then you're like, okay, well, what am I going to do for the rest of my time if I don't have maternity leave or FMLA?
But fortunately. The world has adjusted that benefits people who are traveling for adoptions.
AishaOverdub: Okay. Thank you for that. And then the home study. When I was considering adoption, the home study was the thing that would just have a grip on me, like, what does that mean? Do I have to have extra room? Do I have to buy, you know, all this stuff?
So can you demystify for some of the listeners about what the home study is and what does it entail?
Jourdan: The home study is basically just a way for the agency to see that you are financially responsible enough to afford adoption and raise a child and also make sure that you are not a criminal.
So I was also super nervous about the home study, especially the home visit. It is a very intensive thing to do because they're looking at your life. So we had to do like an autobiographical statement, which was, I think like a 10 page questionnaire, each one for me and one for my husband. And then we had one that we had to do together.
And then you have the, Background checks, your home visit, and then your in person interviews. So some of the questions that we got on the questionnaire like, were you hugged as a child? How were you shown discipline? What's your favorite memory growing up? What's something that your parents did that you won't do?
What's something that your parents did that you would do? They want to know all of our siblings, how old they are, where they live, what they did for a living, and what our relationships were. We had to do a monthly budget because they wanted to know how much money we had left over at the end of the month and make sure that we are financially responsible
AishaOverdub: and that
Jourdan: we can also afford it because they're not going to want to place a child with you if you're living paycheck to paycheck.
AishaOverdub: As
Jourdan: you had to do a background check. So there's the state level check. Then there's the FBI level check. So the state level is just in the state you live in now. The FBI was for the entire country. So everywhere that you lived before now, you also had to do the child abuse and neglect registry to make sure there are no open.
Or pending cases that involves child abuse or neglect, because why would anyone place a child with somebody who has a history of child abuse?
AishaOverdub: Right, right.
Jourdan: We had to get letters of recommendation. So the first home study we did for our son, we needed three from family members and then three from like non family members.
AishaOverdub: And then
Jourdan: the second time around, we only needed three. So they're just people that you know, that can attest to the fact that you are good people. and we had our in person interview with the agency. So that was probably about two hours. So they want to know like, how do you resolve conflict as a couple?
What parenting style do you think that you're going to have? They want to know all these things, but for a single mom, they would want to know. What's your support system like? If something happened and you got called in to work on an emergency, who would come watch the child for you?
AishaOverdub:
Jourdan: Have somebody be on call for you during the night.
Do you have a night nurse plan? Do you have a childcare plan? Do you plan on staying home? If you do stay home, do you have a savings? Is there a job that you can work from home so that you can be the primary caregiver for the child? They want to know what your plan is for the child and what brought you to the point of wanting to adopt.
Have you had fertility issues? Are you currently pursuing fertility treatments? Because they won't work with you if you're actively trying to get pregnant, because they feel like you should pick one or the other. A lot of people will treat and adopt a child differently than a biological child. And a lot of agencies will not put a child in that position where they feel like they have to compete with a biological baby that just popped up.
Because with an adopted child, there is a difference in making sure that you form that secure bond because you're strangers, right? When we got placed, I was very nervous about him not bonding with us because he's like, who are these people? Oh, he knows you. He knows you're his mom. I'm like, we just met a week ago.
He does not know I'm his mom. He's just like, who is this lady? They keep singing me these songs off key or something, so it's like you have to let them know like, I am your primary caregiver, and someone's like baby wearing and talking to him and everything to make sure he knows like, I'm your mom, okay, like if you need something, I'm the one that's gonna come take care of you.
So they want to know like, are you gonna be, you know, what's your commitment level to being able to do this? So, you know, something happens, there is a medical concern later, are you going to be able to take care of it? Or if there's a behavioral issue later, like, what's your plan? Are you going to put them in therapy?
What type of therapy are you considering putting them in? What's your school system like? There's all types of questions that they wouldn't ask somebody who is getting pregnant on their own. Yeah. Like people
AishaOverdub: who get pregnant on their own.
Jourdan: Some of them do CPR certifications. So like my sister is somebody who I refer a lot of people to because she does her CPR and basic life support courses.
So I tell people like, look. If you're trying to learn CPR, call her because she will teach you more than the standard stuff will because they want to like, you know, be able to give them the Heimlich Maneuver and like the little baby CPR and everything because forget to breathe when they're small and you gotta learn how to wake them back up and say, okay.
AishaOverdub: they still doing the Thane Alive?
Jourdan: So we had to do nine hours when we adopted our son. So it was nine hours of video courses. And then we have a notebook, like a binder. It was like 200 pages of reading material.
AishaOverdub: Okay.
Jourdan: Of all the types of things, like safe sleep, munchhausen by proxy. Sleep cycles as kids get older, nonviolent forms of discipline.
A lot of agencies will have you sign some type of affidavit or something that says that you will not use physical discipline on the child. The nonviolent forms of discipline was a big one that they pushed because they just, it kind of went through every age and how you should effectively discipline your children based on what goes on, what a two year old is doing.
It's going to be different than what a 12 year old is doing, how to test their boundaries and stuff, and then also why could they be acting this way?
AishaOverdub: And you
Jourdan: know, adoptive children will have sometimes a little bit different emotions when it comes to hormones and stuff. Then emotions are going to come up, you know, like when you were going through puberty and you're just like super moody and then you tack on adoption to that.
So their experience is going to be different than somebody else's. And they're like, okay, well maybe they're going to start having more questions about the adoption when they get to that age. You know, you need to be prepared to have these conversations with them, but it's not as scary as it seems. It's just very time consuming.
Okay. Once you have everything set in place, almost the paperwork is the hardest part. The home visit was a breeze. It was just like, when somebody comes over, you're just like, Oh yeah, let me show you around their bedroom. This is the bathroom. But like, you can have an apartment, you can have a townhouse.
We had a townhouse when we adopted our son. And they just want to know like, okay, is this going to be his room? This is going to be the bathroom that he used when he grows up or he or she, cause we didn't know. That was just the main thing. And then if you have any weapons, they want to know they're going to be locked up.
Another thing you will need is your adoption profile book. So that is very important to have, because that's what the expected mom. Or the expected family looks at to choose who they want to ultimately, like, place their baby with. So I'm like, do not skimp or, like, half do your profile book because that's your first impression.
So that's, like, a huge point I tell people. Like, make sure you have a good profile book and don't try to be like, oh yeah, it's only one page or say, like, especially if you're trying to self match in the groups. Just saying like, oh, message me for more information is not going to be helpful because there's going to be at least a hundred other people commenting on there, and the expected parent isn't going to go through and message everybody.
AishaOverdub: So Jordan, when you talk about the profile book, is it something that an agency gives you? Is it something that you should have laminated? Can you use Canva? how do you put it together?
Jourdan: There is a designer that I refer everyone to who is amazing. She does really good jobs. I used to design them, but I just don't have the time to anymore, so I started referring people to her.
The designer that we use, she sells like a DIY template that you can buy and just kind of load your own pictures and text into. So the templates are already done, then you just drag and drop your photos into it. So this is ours. It is basically just like a life book. It just kind of gives an example of what a life with us would look like.
So like the things we like to do, places we like to travel to. This is about me and my family. Then my husband and his family. Then like some of our family and friends in here. What our parenting philosophy is, things that are important to us. And so I feel like this just gives the mom a good example of who you are.
Then from the books, she narrows down who she actually wants to set up a Zoom call or video call with. So if you're working with an agency, And she is like, oh, I'm open to same sex couples, heterosexual couples, single moms. I just want at least one person who's Black. Then they'll go through their list of everybody who matches that.
So then she goes through all of those books and then narrows it down. And says, okay, I want to talk to these three people. Sets a Zoom call with them, and then from there she'll say, okay, I want to match with this person. So, when you've got so many other people, Like their name in the hat, you've got to make sure that you have a good profile book that's going to kind of set you apart, or at least give her an idea of who you are.
I'm like, okay, well, what does your profile book look like? It's like, oh, we don't have one. It's like, oh, well, how is she gonna learn anything about you? Like, oh, she can message me. She's not going to want to do that. Like, she's a pregnant person in crisis right now. She probably doesn't have time to sit around and message 30 people to get to know 30 people.
And you're like, okay, what are you interested in? Like, what's your idea of an open adoption? What's your idea of a closed adoption? What are you looking for? So then she's got to go through all that with all these people. So it's like, you want to try to lessen the burden for her as much as possible by making sure that you have all of your things in place and agencies let them know, they look online to research, like, what should I be looking for?
So they know to look for somebody who is home study approved, who has their profile books. If you don't have either one of those, the mom's going to be like, Oh, they're not serious. And she's going to move on to somebody else.
AishaOverdub: So, Jordan, I have two questions. One question, since you brought up who actually gets to see the profile books or which profile books get put in front of a parent, and we know that there is this discrepancy in stories from Black parents and parents who are non Black, is there any type of regulatory mechanism in place by states that goes in and sees how many parents get presented and how many matches based on demographic characteristics?
Jourdan: because their agencies are all like private entities. They keep track of how many moms they have, but there really isn't much in place because they can just kind of operate however they see fit for their organization.
AishaOverdub:
Jourdan: They just have like regulations as far as what it is they're allowed to offer to the moms,
AishaOverdub: but
Jourdan: there's no guidelines that say if it is a Black expected mom you have to give her first priority to Black families.
They're going to give first priority to, typically they give first priority to whatever waiting families they have that have already paid their Agency fee, matching fee, and that type of thing. Usually by the time the agencies and consultants and attorneys reach out to me, the mom has already seen the profiles that the agency has, and then she's like, Oh no, I really want a black family.
And then they'll call me and say like, Hey, we showed her about 10 profiles, but she really wants like a black family or at least one black person. So do you have anybody available? And I'd be like,
AishaOverdub: Yes,
Jourdan: I have a bunch of people available.
AishaOverdub: See, okay. So that was going to be my final question for this episode is where do you come in along the adoption process?
Are you walking with the hopeful adoptive parent all the way through the process? Do people find you on Facebook and say, I want to work with you? Like, how does that work in terms of your relationship building and where you come in and someone else's adoption journey?
Jourdan: They usually do find me on social media if they're not already just like in my Facebook group and they'll just say like, oh, we're interested in adopting.
We're not sure where we start. What do we need to do? So, if it's somebody who's at the very beginning, then I kind of walk them through like, okay, this is what you need to do. You need to get your home. So you need to get an attorney. This is kind of what it looks like. If there's somebody who's already home study approved, we have a membership for them.
So they'll sign on to that and then all of the adoption situations that come in will get posted there. So then they can kind of filter through them and say, okay, because some people are gender specific. So then they can look through and say, okay, well, how many girl situations do we have available? Let me apply for those.
Some people don't have a preference and they just apply for whatever becomes available if they feel like they're a good fit for it. So, the difference with working with me as opposed to just one agency is that the agency can only give you situations for the moms that they're working with. Since I work with so many agencies and attorneys, we get a lot of them coming in from all over the place.
So, last year we had over 65 potential adoption situations come in, where the mom was explicitly looking for black, biracial, or interracial hopeful families, and she was usually open to single moms as well. But it still goes back to making sure that the Black woman has the choice. Cause primarily it's the Black women who are making the adoption plan.
Nine times out of 10, it's a Black mom who's like, no, I really want a Black couple. So it's also, as much as it is for the couples, it's also for the expecting moms, even though I never work with them or get to meet them, it's like making sure that she has a choice in where the child goes and if she's like, no, I really want a Black family.
Then I'm here making sure that she has the options. Now I'm like, I want the most Black, hopeful, adoptive parents as possible. It goes from being told, Oh, we only have one interracial couple available to let me call Jordan, she's got 50 couples or 50 hopeful parents that you can choose from. When you have more options, you can make a more informed decision.
And then you feel like you're making the best choice because Like you really never know. We had one single mom who was told that it was going to take her years to adopt because she's a single mom. She signed on with me. The first situation that she saw, she submitted for a couple of days later. She got a call from the attorney saying that the mom chose her.
So she was like, Oh, it's so exciting. And then she was placed in January, Mother's Day weekend. She got a call from the attorney that the mom was pregnant again. Wanted to know if she'd be willing to take on this baby because she wanted to keep the siblings together. So she was like, absolutely yes. And then we found out that it was twins.
AishaOverdub: Oh my goodness! Mazel Tov! Blessings!
Jourdan: So she had two adoptions with it, like placed twice within a year with three kids and she's like, well now my family's complete. So, it's like you really never know. Some people it takes longer to match only because like some of the expecting moms are looking for something specific.
Like I've heard where they're like, oh I'm looking for somebody where the mom is going to be a nurse, or I want somebody who loves animals, who has a lot of pets. Blessings! So if they're looking for that specific thing, then it can take longer for people to be matched. We had somebody chosen because she had a picture of her baking cookies in her profile book.
She was like, I was grappling back and forth of whether or not I was going to put that picture in there. I'm like, Oh, nobody's going to care that I like to bake. But the mom saw it and she was like, this looks like a mom who's going to make snacks after school. And so that's what I'm looking for.
For us, we got chosen twice because there's a picture of my husband and my son playing basketball, and both of those expected moms had played basketball, and dads also played basketball. So they were like, Oh, that's so cool. We love basketball. You love basketball. So, You really never know. That's why my book has a ton of pictures in it.
Some people focus more on text, but I'm like, the photos are going to show it. Like there could be somebody who loves Disney and then sees this picture of us at Disney world and she's like, Oh my gosh, yes, this is the family that I see because I used to love going to Disney as a kid and they go to Disney.
So that's who I'm going to pick. Use as many pictures that's going to show all the fun things that you enjoy doing. If you like to travel, put those in there. If you have a little hobby of like crocheting and you've got a picture of you crocheting, put that in there. You want to try and make yourself look as appealing as possible, but just give more insight on who you are.
If all of your pictures are only professional photo shoots, then it's going to be like, okay, well, I don't really know much about this person because all these photos are staged. If you've got like Eight nieces and nephews, and you take them to the zoo once a month. Post pictures, put your pictures of that in there.
It'll see that you have a bigger support system and that even though you are a single mom, the child is not going to be lacking in anything because you have enough people that will be in the child's life to make sure that. There is going to be enough male influence. You've got five brothers, so you don't necessarily need a husband to help you because all the uncles
AishaOverdub: will
Jourdan: be there.
AishaOverdub: Pee through the cheerio.
Jourdan: Yeah. Like my sister is a single mom and my niece, and we say like, you know, she has enough uncles to where she doesn't really feel like she's. Lacking on anything. Every daddy daughter dance, somebody's there. She just had my husband and he's like, do you want, I'll get it for you.
And yeah, like, so she's fine where she just knows that she's got all these uncles and if she even looks at something for a little while, I'm like, do you want it? Okay, I'll give it a shot. We got you.
AishaOverdub: Well, Jordan, thank you so much for taking the time to share your insights, your experience, and your joy for doing the work that you do.
Now, where could people in the Start to Finish Motherhood, Melanated Community, Find you, where are you on your socials? Where can they join your community? Tell us a little bit about how people can contact you.
Jourdan: Okay. So my website is NoirAdoption. com. That's N O I R E adoption. com. So there you can find more information about our services.
You can read my story there. My calendar is on there. So if you want to book a call with me to just answer questions about your Specific adoption or what it is that you're looking for. My Instagram that I primarily use is Black Adoption Matters. We also have the Noir Adoption. And Facebook group. If you search for Black Families Hoping to Adopt, it should come up.
Or if you put Noir Adoption in Facebook, you'll find our. Facebook page and the community should come in there as well.
AishaOverdub: All right. Well, thank you. And hopefully all my listeners have found this episode insightful and as enjoyable as I did. So Jordan, thank you. And that's it for now.
Thanks for listening to Start to Finish Motherhood with Aisha. If you want to keep the conversation going, follow Start to Finish Motherhood on Instagram or email me at aisha at starttofinishmotherhood. com. If you love this episode, please share it with anyone who's thinking of becoming a single mother by choice, anyone who's already parenting as a single mother by choice and just looking for advice on navigating it all, or a friend or family member who's looking to support someone else's single mother by choice journey.
Thank you. Until next time, bye now.
